some pics of the pick up (rubbish pick up by river Dodder)

Saturdays from Sat 12 June 11am a group will meet somewhere along Dodder or other places South Dub / Dundrum / Wicklow and pick up rubbish. Very nice way of getting out and experiencing some Nature. :)


Among the Nature experienced this time was nettle stings, briar scratches, wrestling with weeds to extract bigger interesting items of rubbish. We found a ladybird village. Kate liked that. We picked up down towards Clonskeagh and up to some little park up from that pub near the bridge where we met.

A cheeky slogan that came into my head on the way home:
 (after stopping and picking up broken and unbroken bottles at a bus stop just after Dundrum)
 (and picking up a yet unbroken one on the road)

 Picking up the mess
  .. after other people
     .... Green Party

:) It's a haiku because the pauses have to be counted!! :-P

We met on Sat 12 June at Classon's Bridge. In Milltown. (That's the bridge near that pub (Dropping Well) near to under the Luas viaduct over the Dodder.) Meeting Next Sat 19 June at Rathfarnham bridge.

Announce and info: http://www.eamonryan.ie/

Any questions contact Kevin at kevindennehy@hotmail.com , ring him on 085.100.39.55 or phone 01.299.55.13

Dublin South Greens are organising a clean up of the river Dodder from the M50 to Clonskeagh.

Saturdays at 11am. We will work until 16.00 so feel free to come for an hour or two, or the whole day if you wish. The clean up will involve litter picking along the footpaths and cycleways along the river. We will be cleaning the river bed and banks in September after the hatching and nesting season are over and we expect to take two Saturdays to do the part of the river mentioned.

We will provide litter pickers, bags and gloves and will have tea, coffee and biscuits as well. Hope to see you there!

Why people vote the wrong way!?

This from the BBC is very interesting.

"in politics, when you are explaining, you are losing. And that makes anything as complex or as messy as healthcare reform a very hard sell."

"stories always trump statistics"

"in contemporary politics, if you can fake sincerity, you have got it made"

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8474611.stm

... please excuse me ... this is how I rant ... mostly to myself inside my head ... sometimes to Fionnuala ... sometimes to my computer/everyone in the whole wide intarweb ...

What in this world now is not made complex, even seemingly simple things opened up to debate and put under the microscope suddenly have murky waters with hydraen creatures lurking). Any issues with complexity like any green/environment/planning issues, like Lisbon have many facets. If you are against one facet then it puts you against the whole thing. Focus is much more easily put against any negative facets and positive facets count for nothing.

We must understand all facets of an issue logically and scientifically correctly and work out the best solutions. But when debating politically and persuading people the logic and intellectual argument only counts for a little.

Can we debate and convince people of the correct argument in an entertaining and sincere and emphatic way which is also honest and accurate?

After working out the intellectual argument every point should be translated to allegory. But that can then be countered by better allegory. Nuts.

etymology of allegory

Ben Goldacre's bad Science

Bruce Schneier on Security

Green Party Ireland

Irish elections. "Waaah. It's not faaaair! :("

€€€ jobs banks €€€ jobs banks €€€ jobs banks €€€ jobs banks €€€ jobs banks €€€
Irish people: "Waaah. It's not faaaair! :("
vote vote vote vote vote vote vote vote vote vote vote vote
Me: "Waaah. It's not faaaair! :("

Good to see FF down loads.
However Green Party have been decimated in the local councils.
(I'm a bit sorry FF people, actually I'm liking the current FF government (heavens forbid!) compared with the opposition! However you have a long history to overcome before I would trust you.)
IMHO you need a good scattering of crazy green people especially at local council level.
This is why I'm Waahing.

And who has gained? Labour (Which is okay by me, I think.)
And FG have gained who I view as being the same as FF (except for not being in power for last long while so perhaps more innocent).
But one definate thing is I don't hear anything about solutions or politics from FG or Labour.

Dammit.

Bah.

Meh.

One thing I think I can say for sure is that the voters are expressing displeasure.
I think that might be all that I'm sure about.
What exactly are they displeased with?
The current state of the economy right now I think.
Did people vote in council people based on their performance in this council term and the past ... ?
I think even some very solid local people suffered this time just through association with being in government.

Why have the Greens been punished so much?
Perhaps their vote is not that strong anyway so when you're in a negative place you are going to be decimated.

IMHO Greens in government is good. If you are out and always stay out you're irrelevant. If you are in you can influence policy and make a real difference and influence the people you're in government with and make them greenish left liberal honest too. I don't quite see why the banks have to get such huge support when they are still inclined to squander but apart from that I think this government is generally doing okay. I think on the Environment with the roads through Tara and with Shell in Mayo the Green agenda has had to hold it's tongue in government and that's hard but you can't just stay out of government and leave FG/Labour allow things to be even worse for planning generally as well as worse for Tara and Mayo.

It's too late to vote this government out of office!
2 years ago was the chance to do that!
There were plenty of people, Greens especially warning about the economy, about wasting money, about the overinflated property bubble 2 years ago.
And what happened 2 years ago? I would have loved for FF to be booted out.
FF got quite a nice proportion of the vote, not quite 50% seats but a very comfortable amount.
The people spoke (and sure it was a nice sunny day as well).
Did FG/Labour want another election then?
They seem to want another election now.
Isn't that like voting a few times on the Nice Treaty? (or abortion, or divorce, or contraception)
A necessary thing actually! :-) In time.

If it was a national election would people really bash FF?
I don't see any good proposals from FG and Labour.
If the running of the country was really on the line would people see the lack of anything solid from FG or Labour?

FF === FG as far as I can see so to increase the vote for FG is surely a stupid reaction.
They are the same with regards policies (which they generally don't write down/publish and keep vague!)
Their policy on honesty and corporate donations are the same (yes, we'll have that €€€€ thank you very much ka-ching!).
They've a long history in local government (and across the country planning decisions especially have suffered from bad decisions from many councils).

Labour are also playing the sure we are green anyway and we we do planning as well card now, which is a bit annoying seeing as they've a long history in government and on local councils without making a difference. Come on Labour! Put your money where it matters and show you can be honest by supporting strict regulation of donations.

I have been looking to FG or Labour for something and would have liked to support them but they have put nothing sensible forward. SO I found in this election I voted Green and for a couple of good local councillors and then there was nobody else worth a vote :(.

What should the Green party especially do now?

The morally correct / honourable thing would be to stay in and influence this government as much as possible in the right direction. If they stay in government green voters and people could get more disillusioned with the party "selling it's soul". We're not "selling our souls" guys! We're taking evil parts of FF souls and making them a little bit green, a little bit pink and generally more colourful. If the Greens go out of government ... well, I think there is no good reason to go out of government (no good moral reason!). I also think Greens could be just decimated by an election now and even if not the government dynamics would probably make it that we have 1 or 2 big parties in power (the parties with the vague not-written-down poolicies!). A National Government fills me with that warm squirmly horribly sick feeling - but that's okay - it looks like it gives the same feeling to FG and Labour.

What would be the thing to do for the green party if they just wanted to grow in size and power?
People (I hope I hope) will vote for good candidates people who work hard on local issues for councils.
People are a bit stupid when voting quite often maybe? And will vote for celebrity. Will vote AGAINST things much easier than voting for things. Do people really not care about party policies just about more single issues that crop up.
So appearance/media is everything. To get elected by Irish voters you must look and sound good, make good impressions and manipulate the system to stay looking good. I don't think Green people want even to be thinking about this!
Maybe the best policy for greenish-pinko-liberal people is to hide their good policies and agenda and work on that in quiet and on the surface manipulate the system as much as possible in whatever political vehicle is handy.

Maybe(Hopefully!) good people working away locally (2 greens left with council seats! :() and nationally, out of power and in can build up a good reputation which would be apparent to people generally. And maybe that would translate into votes and into a good influence in the right place.

Hopefully.